Season One: Episode Four

Prominent TikToker, Kudani, talks with Ryan about her selection, “Thieves,” by the industrial band Ministry as well as her time working in record stores, how she organizes her collection, how she got started on TikTok, and more!

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Kudani: I think one of the funniest stories to me, oh my God. So I was working at a record store and we got in a collection, well, we had to go to his house, this very strange dude who had the best heavy psych collection, obscure garage and psych kind of bands I have ever seen in my life. You know, original 13th Floor Elevators, just all of that kind of stuff. Toe Fat, just a bunch of stuff I had never heard of.

Anyway, so, and it was all the records were in good condition. Some of the covers were, you know, a little bit used, but overall it was a fantastic collection. And the owner of the store negotiated and we got that collection. However, the gentleman’s name was Skip. And he wrote his name on every single cover. So it said “Skip.”

Ryan: Oh no!

Kudani: Which is not a word that you want to see on a record cover, because I literally had hundreds of conversations with people coming in and going, “Oh! I was really looking for that Toe Fat album. Oh, does it skip?” I’d be like, “Oh… No! The guy who owned it was named Skip and he wrote his name.” Over and over and over and over and over. It was hilarious. It got to the point where I was just like, “Okay, sure, alright.”

Ryan: I’m very excited to introduce my guest on today’s episode, Kudani, a professional photographer who has also worked in record stores and has been collecting records since the ’19’70s, which is the primary subject of her TikTok account. Kudani is a prominent TikToker within the VinylTok subculture, posting videos about records in her collections, new finds, stories about bands, and other music-related trivia. I’d been following her for a while now and wanted to get her pick for an opening track. After tackling the challenge and narrowing down her list, she picked “Thieves” by the industrial band Ministry off of The Mind Is A Terrible Thing To Taste.

Let’s Make A Mixtape.

[Intro music by Scotty Sandwich]

Ryan: Thank you so much for joining me and helping to make this season one mixtape of opening tracks. Your selection was “Thieves” by Ministry off of their record The Mind is a Terrible Thing to Taste. Oh, beautiful, there it is, the x-ray cover.

Kudani: You know, I found out that this X-Ray was actually one of the bandmate’s mother’s X-Ray.

And he got it because she’s got a plate in her head. And I think the rest of the band members were like, “absolutely not.” And he was like, “absolutely.” So yeah, this is somebody’s mom’s.

Ryan: I know we’re talking about industrial, but that is pretty metal.

Kudani: That is… well, this album is pretty metal. I mean, it is industrial, but we go pretty metal with this one, so…

Ryan: Yeah. So tell me why are you picking “Thieves” for the opening track mixtape?

Kudani: Man, you know, I struggled because I came up with so many really good first songs, but it was my immediate first thought, so I thought I would go with my gut instinct.

Ryan: Yeah, you gotta.

Kudani: Because that song just absolutely rips. So, yeah.

Ryan: I haven’t taken a huge dive into Ministry, so this was a good excuse to do that. I like the full metal jacket samples that they’ve thrown in there.

Kudani: R. Lee Ermey’s, yeah.

Ryan: And so you have that actual record. When did you pick that one up?

Kudani: This one is actually a repress. I have an original somewhere, but this is a…what was this? Master disc re- it’s a numbered reissue, limited edition one. I Got into Ministry with With Sympathy their very first album, which is a straight-up synth pop dance thing that a lot of people who know Ministry don’t know that album.

But I loved that album. We used to listen to them and listen to the songs in the clubs, kind of the gothy dark, kind of dark wave clubs in the eighties. And then I just kind of followed them and the music changed drastically over the years.

And by the time we got to this, I was 19 and I had already been into them and seen them. And then when this hit, our minds were just like, this is the most amazing thing I’ve ever heard. And then I followed them on this tour.

So yeah, they toured in 89 to 90. So I saw them in Austin and then came to Dallas. And then I went up to Tulsa, which I had lived in Tulsa before. So I had friends up there. So I followed them three shows in a row over the course of like four or five days for this.

Ryan: That’s awesome. What was that experience? Have you done that for any other bands?

Kudani: I did that with White Zombie, with three shows in a row though, probably not- two shows pretty frequently like Jesus Lizard, even Duran Duran, stuff like that, but this is the one that I followed the most, or the longest.

And that, the tour for this album, The Mind is a Terrible Thing to Taste, they recorded a bunch of those sessions. You can watch the videos on YouTube. And an album came out of it, a live album called, In Case You Didn’t Feel Like Showing Up from these sessions. And I was pretty much covered head to toe in bruises by the end of that from those pits were some of the most intense pits I’ve ever been in. Just covered.

Worth it though, ’cause they had like chicken wire fence and double drummers. Martin Atkins came in from Pigface as well as their original drummer, Bill Reiflin. And people were climbing up the chicken wire and stage diving off of it and throwing things. It was pure mayhem and totally awesome.

Ryan: That is wild. I love a good double drummer set as well.

Kudani: Yeah, them and Melvins, whenever Melvins do double drummers, and Butthole Surfers when King Coffey and Teresa Nervosa would do double drumming. Those are my three favorites.

Ryan: I saw the Osees, or I don’t remember which version of the Osees they were going under, but I saw them a few years back and they had a double drummer situation going. It was incredible to watch them.

Kudani: That’s so cool. I’ve never seen them and I love the Osees. I know, you know, it changes up pretty drastically here and there with the lineup and the music. But man, that would be cool.

Ryan: It was a really tight show and the thing that really stuck with me as I was watching them, one of the drummer’s kits fell apart a little bit. Like there was something wrong with it, but the band didn’t miss a beat. It was such a professional recovery. Like the drummer, I think, kept going to some degree, but you could tell he was fixing something and the band just vamped and let him recover. It was… flawless, like you couldn’t tell that there was anything wrong and that was just excellent. Similar thing happened with Dommengang, not a double drummer situation, but one of his floor toms fell over and he just overcompensated and put one hell of a performance on for that song while his floor tom was just falling over. It was incredible.

Kudani: Yeah, a good recovery is amazing when it’s a good type band and they all rally around and get stuff done and you can barely tell. Yeah, it’s very, very cool. I’ve seen quite a few of those. I mean, even Gibby Haynes with Butthole Surfers, you know, he would destroy things on stage and they would all just keep going. You know, he’d be like… hitting things with a mallet and everybody’s just playing around him, recovering whatever he’s destroying on stage with the double drummers too. So Yeah, impressive

Ryan: Amazing. I love it. So I guess going back to Ministry, what about Thieves really brings you into that record? Why do you think it works so well as the opening track to that album?

Kudani: I think there’s an immediate tense. It’s immediately very tense right off the bat. It’s kind of a staccato beginning, an opening.

You’re like, “what is about to happen?” And then it just slams you full-force into that song. And you know, at that point, having already been a big Ministry fan and listening to them go from synth-pop to synth-y kind-of- industrial to industrial… to this one, which is also industrial, but with metal. It’s like a thrashy-er guitars.

But you could tell the band had been together long enough that the song is super, super tight, even though it’s like a very controlled chaos is what it is. Yeah, it just immediately sucks you in. And then I like that kind of sneaky, and then all of a sudden you’re on fire, you know?

Ryan: Do you remember if they opened that tour that you saw with “Thieves” or did they have a different opening track for their set?

Kudani: “Thieves” was further in.

Ryan: Interesting, okay.

Kudani: I feel like it was. And I can’t remember if the setlists were the same for each one of those, but I feel like “Thieves” was further in, but the crowd just absolutely lost their mind and that was when the pit would absolutely explode. And KMFDM was the opening band for the shows, that I saw anyway, so everybody was already pumped up on some industrial. I would have to check the setlist, but I’m pretty sure that it was further into the set.

Ryan: In the episodes that I’ve recorded, it’s interesting to see the different camps of what makes a good opening song for a record and does that song translate into an opening song for a set or no. And so it’s interesting to see the difference with this one to where it was more in the in the middle of a set.

Kudani: I feel like I could be wrong, because I am old and have seen too many shows. So my memory might be blurring a little bit, but I’m pretty sure that it was further in. And they were doing… So this released in like September of ’89, I feel like, and maybe November. So when I saw these shows, I’m pretty sure it was like December and January. It hadn’t been out for very long. And back then it was pre-internet, and this stuff wasn’t being played on the radio, you know, so… They were playing songs… There was definitely some stuff from the previous album, The Land of Rape and Honey, and also Twitch. But… I’m, yeah, I’m almost positive that “Thieves” was in a little bit further.

Ryan: And that sounds like an absolutely wild experience. Is that one of the crazier shows that you’ve been to?

Kudani: Yeah, and I get asked all the time, like, what’s your favorite concerts? What’s your favorite shows? And that always springs to mind because it was just the energy. I blame those concerts for some of my hearing loss specifically, because I was young and dumb and didn’t wear hearing protection in 89 and 90. I learned, but yeah.

Ryan: Yeah, it took me a while to learn that lesson as well.

Kudani: And now I always do. I will not go anywhere without hearing protection. But that show, or that tour and like Bad Brains was always up there really high for live shows, Fishbone, I mean there’s a bunch but this is definitely at least in the top three probably of live shows. And I’ve seen everybody or I used to anyway.

Ryan: I know you had a list that you’re trying to whittle down for top opening tracks. Do you want to share some of the others that you were trying to decide between?

Kudani: Yes, I do. I really, really struggled with this because I just kept coming up with more and more and more. Okay, one of the big ones was Killing Joke, “Requiem,” from the first self-titled album.

I think that really sets the pace for what they were about. If you listen to that album, you will be a lifelong fan. Even though they change a little bit in their style, that’s consistently Killing Joke. It’s just very melodic and dub and it’s fantastic.

I also went the other direction with something more gentle. Not everything I listen to is so extreme, but Nick Cave, “Do You Love Me,” from the album Let Love In, that’s my favorite Nick Cave album and that song, so good. It’s so, so good.

I miss… I love the stuff that Nick Cave is doing now with Warren Ellis, but his harsher, carnival barker, street preacher-era stuff is my favorite. And that is just, it’s like gritty and dirty and sexy and just beautiful at the same time. So those were my two really big other contenders, but there were a bunch more.

Okay, I will mention this one because I really thought this was another one I was gonna go for was Santigold from her self-titled album, the song “L.E.S. Artistes.”

I preach the gospel of Santigold all the time and I think that she does not get the props and the recognition that she deserves. Because she’s amazing and that song, when I heard it, I remember the first time I heard it just stopped me in my tracks. I was like, “what the fuck is this?” Amazing. She’s amazing. She deserves more attention, I think.

Ryan: Yeah, you don’t hear that name often.

Kudani: No, she has a recent album, but she was going to tour and she’s one of those artists that said that she couldn’t afford to tour. You know, that’s a whole thing right now with artists saying that they just can’t make any money. Even though she’s not… a small venue, she’s not a huge venue, she’s medium, you know, and she said that she just couldn’t do it.

Ryan: Yeah, it’s a weird time right now, especially with venues taking significant portions of merch cuts and all that.

Kudani: I mean, I’m not a musician and I know that you are and you do touring and stuff like that, but you know, half my friends are touring musicians or musicians, and I hear it from them too that right now, especially. Any venue that takes a merch cut, I will not support them, p eriod. Because if they’re taking money out of the pockets, one of the few ways that working bands can make money, absolutely not.

Ryan: I just learned that a prominent venue around here takes a merch cut, and I’m kind of pissed about it.

Kudani: But I mean it puts the bands in an awkward place. You may still have to do it, but as a fan, I can go up to that owner and say, “what the fuck are you doing, dude?” Because I’m not worried about losing my job or anything. You guys are put in an awkward position. But with the advent of things like Spotify and Google Play and stuff, how are musicians supposed to make any money? You’re not making any money that way, that’s for sure.

Ryan: At least, for us, the goal is just to make it pay for itself at the end of the day. And it’s not the most easy thing to do.

Kudani: I mean, at least there is a resurgence in people collecting physical media.

Ryan: That is true.

Kudani: So if you put out cassettes or CDs or vinyl, if you can afford that initial upfront cost and recoup it, that is a way to generate some revenue. I talk about this stuff probably too much on my channel, but I’m really big on supporting bands and musicians and independent labels, you know?

Ryan: Yeah, that’s great. And then you have how many thousands of records?

Kudani: About five-ish? I Think?

Ryan: Do you have everything catalogued? What’s your-

Kudani: Oh, absolutely not. No, it drives everybody crazy. My records are not in order. I do have some groupings, like right here is Gang of Four, all my Ministry is right here, but yeah, no. My metal is in one of the other shelves, but yeah, it drives people insane. Because I’ll have like… Al Green next to Conan next to Sleep next to I don’t know, whoever, Ministry, you know, it doesn’t yeah, there’s no organization.

Ryan: I mean, sometimes listening to those order or those albums in that order just feels right.

Kudani: Yeah, I mean, if anybody could get in here, I don’t let anybody touch my shit, but if I let anybody in here, it would be a smorgasbord of fun.

Kudani: Because you never know, like you go down and pull stuff and be like, “what?”

Ryan: Well, you’ve been collecting since the 70s, is that correct?

Kudani: Yeah, the first record I bought was I think ’79. I was about nine. I saved up my allowance and bought an Earth, Wind & Fire record, for vinyl. But I had also previously bought cassettes because I could afford that. And I was also living in Kenya, w e were in Africa, so it wasn’t as easy to like get as much physical merch. But I remember buying ABBA cassettes and Bony M. was really big when I was eight.

But yeah, my eldest brother was a big music- he’s a bass player in a punk rock band, or was, and he was a big vinyl guy too. So I would listen to his records and that’s what’s kicked off this nonsense, I think.

Ryan: I wouldn’t say it’s nonsense. I think it’s amazing. And I love watching your channel as you go through them. What inspired you to start a TikTok channel? And I guess what’s that been like for you?

Kudani: It’s weird. The main reason that I did it is, we were in the pandemic, I wasn’t working at the record store anymore, and I just miss talking to people about music.

I figured I’ve got all this stuff, so why not actually talk about it? Because I’ve been watching TikTok videos for a while. So my channel is like a year and a half old. Yeah, it’s about a year and a half old. So yeah, it’s mostly missing the interaction of talking to people in person and being an enabler and a force for making people like other music. You know what I mean?

Or just and just talking to people who are also music nerds. So that was the inspiration behind it.

Ryan: Yeah, it seems like there’s a whole- it took me a little while to get on the TikTok train, but once I realized how good it is at creating these niche communities, I think that’s really- that’s the cool gold behind TikTok, is there is this whole music nerd TikTok subgroup that seems very active and it’s awesome.

Kudani: Just having a lack of community in general, with everything going on, it’s been really beneficial to my mental health.

Ryan: Yeah, I bet, yeah.

Kudani: Plus my channel has grown slowly, but steadily, which is the way I like it. Anytime I get anything that gets semi-viral, I’m like, “oh shit.” Because, I mean, it’s fine. I’m not complaining about it, but, you might get an influx of people who are not really gonna wanna stick around or be as interested, which is fine. You can be a casual TikTok user, but I like that my growth has been slow & steady and the community has really grown.

Like, I usually do lives on Sunday nights and did one last night, and I have a core group of people that show up every weekend and we just, you know, talk about music and, you know, give each other hell. And it’s just a good time, so…

Ryan: That’s awesome. Anything that you’ve discovered because of the TikTok channel?

Kudani: Oh my God, I have become friends with so many bands and musicians. I mean, I found you and now I have your music, for Doomsday Profit, and labels, some label makers and PR people. But like, man, I have found so much great music on TikTok.

There are so many bands that are on the channel and you’re like, what, I’ve never even heard of these people. And there’s like famous people that are on here too, like Radiohead. But it’s the discovery of people that I would never have found otherwise.

Ryan: Do you follow Matt Pike?

Kudani: I do follow Matt Pike. I do follow. I haven’t seen him in a while. Is he still putting stuff out?

Ryan: He put out some photos or some videos of, or maybe there were photos of him. He got in a, I think a bike accident or something. So he was posting pictures of his wounds, which when I first started seeing content from Matt Pike, I was like, this, this isn’t… this is someone pretending to be Matt Pike. But then you look at the videos and it’s definitely Matt Pike. He doesn’t have a ton of followers.

Kudani: Yeah, Matt Pike from Sleep and High on Fire. Oh my God that is so crazy. You know, I did have on my list, I had “Dragonaut” by Sleep from their album, Holy Mountain. That was a contender as well.

Ryan: Yeah, that’s a good one.

Kudani: Like Talking Heads just joined and Jewel is on here. I was not that into her, into Jewel, but her TikTok channel is amazing. Like very genuine and very cool. Yeah.

Ryan: It’s interesting to see how bands are using TikTok as a platform. I’m still trying to, honestly, figure it out on my end, but it’s interesting the different approaches that bands will take if it’s more advice or if it’s showing day in the life kind of things or live performances.

Kudani: I will say as a consumer, instead of a musician, that I really like bands or musicians, TikTok channels, where I want to see a slice of life or a tour. But if you’re sampling or sharing your music to do not just one song, and one song only and to do a slightly longer than 15 second clip so we can hear a little bit more, that’s just from my end. But I like all of it.

The German band, Plainride, they’re a hard rock kind of metal band. They’re so great and they just they covered all the TikToks of their most recent tour with Corrosion of Conformity.

Ryan: The Plainride guides, I connected with them and I actually went to DesertFest Berlin in May and they played there and I was like, hey, Ryan, Doomsday Profit, TikTok. And he was like, ah, cool. And it was this weird kind of moment though, we’d had these interactions on this video app but then-

Kudani: -then it was like real life.

Ryan: And actually, I think, Brenna from Crystal Spiders, hooked them up with that connection with CoC, I think, because Crystal Spiders recorded both their records with Mike Dean. So it was cool to see that kind of like… North Carolina-Germany connection. I love it.

Kudani: You say North Carolina, and I’m just like, Buzzov•en? Buzzov•en? Love me some Buzzov•en! I love them. I love, love, love Buzzov•en. I’ve seen them a bunch. I have a ton of merch and stuff like that. So yeah, I was way into this whole sludge- EYEHAGEGOD, Acid Bath, Buzzov•en, all those guys. I was like way into that in the early 90s. So…

Ryan: I mean, there was a rich scene.

Kudani: There was a rich scene. I miss that scene. That scene was chaos.

Ryan: Yeah, I don’t think it has the same edge now.

Kudani: No. Speaking of TikTok music people, I really love Goth Dad from Vision Video. The goth- I don’t know if you know him, his channel is really good because he’ll do tour stuff and just talking stuff and he’s just very supportive and inclusive and funny and awesome. I think he’s another really good TikTok channel.

@visionvideoband This is @tearsforthedyingofficial #goth #gothrock #deathrock ♬ original sound – Vision Video 🎃 Goth Rock Band

And for a new discovery, there’s a band called Nasty Party from Australia. They’re on Bandcamp, but they don’t have any physical media and they are amazing. They’re kind of like a post-punk, New Wave Australian duo that’s just highly, highly recommended. Nasty Party. Yeah. I’m going to do a video about them soon.

Ryan: Nice. I look forward to it. I’ll link to it in the show notes so people can go watch that one.

@kudanii Sharing one of my favourite current bands: Nasty Party A Punk/New Wave duo from Australia, their music is high energy, danceable and super catchy. For fans of: Magazine, Buzzcocks, Stiff Little Fingers, Wipers, the Ramones and Wire. @NASTY PARTY #nastyparty #punk #newmusic #vinyltok #newwave #postpunk #musicrecommendations #greenscreensticker #australianmusic ♬ Sturm and Drang – Nasty Party

Ryan: My favorite record is the record that I haven’t heard yet. I think that’s always kind of how I go through-

Kudani: That’s exactly, that’s a good philosophy in music nerddom life. The best thing that- yeah, I agree.

Ryan: I’m always hungry for new stuff.

Kudani: Hungry for new stuff, yeah. Bandcamp has become a major source of new music for me. I evangelize Bandcamp because it’s free. You can purchase stuff that will really support the band, physical media, but man, that is a great place to discover new music.

It’s a rabbit hole of listening to one thing, to another thing, to another, and then all of a sudden you have some record from some band in Slovenia that you would have never heard of before. Like Omega Sun is a doom metal band from, I think, Slovenia? Someplace in Eastern Europe that I found on Bandcamp, and they’re also on TikTok. But man, that is a great, great place to find music is Bandcamp.

Ryan: Yeah, I love that platform. I think they, yeah, to your point, it’s perfect for discovery. The radio show that I do probably wouldn’t exist if it weren’t for Bandcamp because it makes it so easy to find bands from far-reaching places that otherwise couldn’t. Yeah, I’ll preach Bandcamp all day long, yeah.

Kudani: I do too. I preach band camp and discogs all damn day.

You know, speaking of finding bands online, what is going on in France? There are so many awesome bands across genres coming out of France

Ryan: I don’t know, but I- the first curated show that I had for Global Garage was the owner of Frantic City Records who put out some amazing compilations. Hamburger- I don’t know how to pronounce this right, Hamburger Saignant or something along those lines. There’s a one and a two and it’s these garage punk compilations that are phenomenal. And that the curated playlist that he did just opened up so much for me. It’s wild.

My wife and I went to Paris a few, well more than a few years back now, but we went into the Born Bad record shop and I was the guy, the counter, actually, no, I take that back-

The first time It was with my work, we had a, we do a mystery trip thing where we’ll go on it, we’ll show up at the airport and they’re like, we’re going here. And one of them was Paris. And I was like, all right, “let’s go check out Born Bad.” So I walked up to to the record store, I went to the, to the guy at the counter and I was like, “so here’s the thing I do this radio show garage, psych, et cetera, recommendations?” And he stacked me up with 10 or 15. One of them was that compilation that I listened to.

I was like, “Holy shit, this is amazing.” I had to reach out to the guy that put it together and that came from there. Also in that was, I think, the first En Attendant Ana record; incredible.

So I went back a year later with my wife. I went back and it was the same guy at the counter. I was like, “Hey, remember me?” And he’s like, “Yeah.” And he gave me, you know, ten more recommendations. And it’s like, the wealth of stuff coming out of there just, yeah, as you said, cross-genre, it’s- there’s some weird creative- and it’s, it’s off kilter stuff, too. It’s like-

Kudani: Right, more experimental.

Ryan: Yeah, you’re listening to it, oh yeah, “this is garage punk, but there’s like, there’s something off about it.” Not in a bad way, it’s just, it’s just-

Kudani: -slightly French-askew.

Ryan: Yeah. I could listen to something and not know that it’s French and I feel like I could probably identify that, yeah, this is probably, probably a French artist.

Kudani: Kind of getting to that point is like, is this French? What the hell is happening? But I love, I love that. And I miss- that’s another thing, like working in record stores, I miss like the customer coming in and saying, Hey, “I’m interested in this. Do you have any recommendations?” And I’m like, “Oh, get out your wallet. Cause I’m about to wreck your life.”

Ryan: How much time do you have? And money?

Kudani: How much time and or money? Yeah.

Ryan: Do you have any stories from those record store days?

Kudani: I think one of the funniest stories to me, oh my God. So I was working at a record store and we got in a collection, well, we had to go to his house, this very strange dude who had the best heavy psych collection, obscure garage and psych kind of bands I have ever seen in my life. You know, original 13th Floor Elevators, just all of that kind of stuff. Toe Fat, just a bunch of stuff I had never heard of.

Anyway, so, and it was all the records were in good condition. Some of the covers were, you know, a little bit used, but overall it was a fantastic collection. And the owner of the store negotiated and we got that collection. However, the gentleman’s name was Skip. And he wrote his name on every single cover. So it said “Skip.”

Ryan: Oh no!

Kudani: Which is not a word that you want to see on a record cover, because I literally had hundreds of conversations with people coming in and going, “Oh! I was really looking for that Toe Fat album. Oh, does it skip?” I’d be like, “Oh… No! The guy who owned it was named Skip and he wrote his name.” Over and over and over and over and over. It was hilarious. It got to the point where I was just like, “Okay, sure, alright.”

But it was like the perfect storm of like very high-end, very expensive, very cool stuff that had the word “skip” on the cover. God damn, dude.

Ryan: That’s hilarious.

Kudani: Just a million little things, yeah, like that. But that’s one of my favorites. I mean, at the time I was not amused, but now looking back it’s pretty funny.

Ryan: Oh, man, that’s, oh. Yeah, the one word you don’t want on there. Yep, ugh.

Kudani: No, absolutely. I mean, it might as well have said “warped.” “Hey, my name is Warped” and put it on the front.

Ryan: Is there anything that we didn’t talk about that you that you wanna talk about? Anything that you wanna shout out or promote?

Kudani: Okay, just back to Ministry for a second

Ryan: Yeah, let’s do it.

Kudani: They are touring. I think they might’ve been touring for this entire album, but something of note is I mentioned the Ministry very first album, With Sympathy, which is very synth-pop, very cheesy, very deep. I love it, but Al Jorgensen uses a fake English accent. He denied and shunned that album forever. Like he would get angry if anybody tried to bring it up. He was very, very hostile.

But just recently he has revisited it and his bandmates have convinced him to, I think they’re going to, re-record all of it, they’ve re-recorded a couple songs, and reissue With Sympathy. And I hope- I don’t, I don’t know what they’re going to name it, but really they, if they named it Without Sympathy with a new updated version of those songs that would be so fucking cool.

That would be the coolest. But anyway, I think it’s kind of interesting because he’s saying that he’s almost done with his career. It would be a nice beginning and end.

But if you’ve never heard this, anybody who’s listening to this, go listen to The Mind is a Terrible Thing to Taste and listen to “Thieves.” And if your socks aren’t blown off, I will give you a refund. I won’t give you a refund. But if you like harder music, this is, this is the shit right here. Absolutely fantastic.

Ryan: And a fantastic addition to the opening tracks playlist. Thank you so much for talking through that. That was awesome. Thank you so much.

Kudani: Thanks for having me.

Ryan: Thank you so much to Kudani for that conversation. Go follow her on TikTok @kudanii and check out her wealth of music knowledge and massive collection that you just got the iceberg tip of here today. Also thank YOU so much for listening. Speaking of that wealth of knowledge, there are a lot of show notes in the transcript. There are a bunch of Bandcamp embeds, and YouYube embeds, so if you want to experience a lot of the music that we talked about here today, you can do so at letsmixtape.com. Of course, be sure to listen to the Season One Playlist as we continue to build it out, either on Spotify or YouTube.

Theme music is by the one-and-only Scotty Sandwich. Make sure to subscribe so you’ll hear my conversation next week with indie musician and Tiny Telephone Recording owner, John Vanderslice. It’s a fun chat, I’m very excited to share it with you. And if you like what you’re hearing, please rate the show because it does help the podcast get discovered. Thanks for listening, I’ll catch you next week.